DGW22 Kane TC

[Rivers]

Why on earth are people still going on about ppg? We can all disagree on whether form or fixtures are more important, but to just ignore both and look only at past performance as some sort of guide is beyond me.

[Finisher1]

Why on earth are people still going on about ppg? We can all disagree on whether form or fixtures are more important, but to just ignore both and look only at past performance as some sort of guide is beyond me.

Because we don't know what form, fixtures and other temporary circumstances will be for the future candidates. They can be good, bad or neutral.

PPG from 20 matches represents the average score from reasonably long period, which includes matches under good, bad and neutral circumstances. That's why it's the best estimation at this point about future GWX.

[Ruth_NZ]

Have to wait and see what Kane does vs. West Ham. If he's benched again then yeah, it's a disaster. If he scores a hit trick then it'll be a big win.

Nope. 18 tripled is a par score for the TC. Anything less than 15 is a fail. 21 or better and you have done well with it.

Probably true, but as you can see the difference between fail and success is just 6 points, so it's really the least valuable chip in the game.

I would give the BB a slightly lower range. In addition, the BB requires more preparation and often has invisible hits one side or the other of playing it. The BB is the least important chip in my opinion.

Good luck trying to get that. Salah is the highest averaging regular starter with 8.0 PPG. So you need Salah to exceed his current average by 30% or better twice in a few days for you to have done well? I know Sanchez ripped out a 27 last year when everyone TCed him so expectations for it would be high once again this year, but I don't know...

You are making the wrong calculation. A par captain score is 8 points. Last season the top 12 teams averaged 8.67 doubled (and once tripled) on captaincy and the top 20k teams averaged 7.86 doubled (based on a random sample). Presumably the TC chip is to be deployed with more care than the weekly captaincy decision because you only get to play it once in 38 games. And presumably in a DGW. So 18 is a fair par score. The season before last, Aguero and Sanchez scored 25 & 26 (from memory) in GW34 and last season Kane scored 27 in GW37 (again from memory). If you prioritise the TC and play it in its optimum slot then you can reasonably hope for 21+ at least.

Finisher1 is right in the underlying analysis that you cannot prioritise all the chips equally. He and I only differ in that I consider the BB to be the weakest and most expendable of the chips and that will be the one I deploy when it is convenient, rather than the TC.

[Owsler]

Anyone know what's the best TC use been since its inception? Any double hattricks or goalkeepers with cleansheets and double penalty saves?

As Coop says above I remember using mine on Sanchez two years running and did very well. But also remember a similar situation to Kane's DGW when Aguero had fantastic fixtures and it was a disaster. In fact I'm pretty sure there was no doubt hanging over his play that year.

[Ruth_NZ]

That was last season when Aguero had 9 points in DGW27. But there were reasons to beware of his prospects that week, same as there were for Kane this week, he hadn't been in great scoring form (1 goal in the last 8 PL games) and was still adjusting his game to suit what Pep wanted of him.

[Coop13]

If you prioritise the TC and play it in its optimum slot then you can reasonably hope for 21+ at least.

There was also a DGW for Arsenal in GW36 where Sanchez 'only' scored 14 from 2 games. Manchester City had a double in GW27 against 2 crap teams and all of their attacking players flunked. I TC'd Aguero that week and all he could muster was 1 goal and 1 bonus point.

I don't know - I just view the TC as something that, even with extensive planning, still requires a decent amount of luck to reap the full rewards. As such I don't set my expectations extremely high for it. And even if you nail it, you may only get a 10-15 point advantage so long as people regular captain your pick (and you regular captain the other mass-TC picks). Or maybe I'm just trying to feel better about Kane's shocking first half return this week.

[Ruth_NZ]

I just view the TC as something that, even with extensive planning, still requires a decent amount of luck to reap the full rewards. As such I don't set my expectations extremely high for it. And even if you nail it, you may only get a 10-15 point advantage so long as people regular captain your pick (and you regular captain the other mass-TC picks). Or maybe I'm just trying to feel better about Kane's shocking first half return this week.

Sure, but all I said was that 18 would be a par score for a TC. Might as well have a realistic benchmark if you want to use one.

As for the relative advantages/disadvantages, you are right but they apply to the BB and FH as well. Neither the BB nor the TC are as important in the scheme of things as they are made out to be. 50% of last season's top 12 finishers TC'd Aguero for 9 points in GW27 (as you did) and that didn't stop them. The other 50% averaged 17 points with it. So a TC fail isn't the end of the world in terms of the OR (although if Kane blanks tomorrow it will be nasty for those that TC'd him even more than for those that C'd him). It might make a big difference in a tight ML but it's nothing to get too hung up about.

[OIEIAO]

Anyone know what's the best TC use been since its inception? Any double hattricks or goalkeepers with cleansheets and double penalty saves?

Kane got 31 in DGW 37 last year. I think he got a goal and one bonus against Man U (something that came to 7 in total) and then 4 goals, an assist and 3 bonus against Leicester (24). The "93" under his name in my girlfriend's team is quite vivid!
I can recall several scores in the 20s but can't recall anyone scoring more than 31 in a DGW or otherwise since the chip came in in 2015/16.

[Finisher1]

Anyone know what's the best TC use been since its inception? Any double hattricks or goalkeepers with cleansheets and double penalty saves?

Kane got 31 in DGW 37 last year. I think he got a goal and one bonus against Man U (something that came to 7 in total) and then 4 goals, an assist and 3 bonus against Leicester (24). The "93" under his name in my girlfriend's team is quite vivid!
I can recall several scores in the 20s but can't recall anyone scoring more than 31 in a DGW or otherwise since the chip came in in 2015/16.

I recall I have asked here if anyone can remember any two consecutive FPL matches where a player has scored at least 34 points combined (ie. which would lead to at least 100 points for a hypothetical TC if it was a DGW). I didn't ask just from TC era, I asked whether it has happened in any FPL matches (so from 2006-07 or whenever the FPL was launched). No one here could remember any example back then.

Since then Kane has done it twice (last two matches last season and GW19-20 this season). I don't recall any other examples but there might be some.

It's possible, but a very very rare event (since we can only recall Kane doing it in FPL era). And DGWs are just a very small minority of all gameweeks, so it's unlikely that these two consecutive matches would be exactly DGW.

[MoSe]

I recall Vallancia in 15/16 decided to play TC in GW9 when Aguero scored 5 goals and got 25p (that is, 25p*3 = 75p) from TC in a Single GW (i.e. not a DGW)
viewtopic.php?p=2843812#p2843812
he didn't come back to Fiso after that sesason tho

Didn't we also have Sanchez and Hazard score 25p and 26p (or 26p and 27p) in the same DGW?
Was it 15/16 or 16/17?

[Chinese Whisperer]

I was hoping for a Kane assist v Swansea. Anyone else feel the same ?

[Stemania]

His illness was a real shame as this was a very good TC opportunity on paper I reckon. I pulled out, but with just under 150% T10K EO I'll be cheering every point just the same. Hopefully Kane will get bucketloads tomorrow for those that did TC.

[Finisher1]

His illness was a real shame as this was a very good TC opportunity on paper I reckon. I pulled out, but with just under 150% T10K EO I'll be cheering every point just the same. Hopefully Kane will get bucketloads tomorrow for those that did TC.

On the other hand, without his illness every manager and his dog would have triple captained him and it would have been a non-event. Yeah, we would have got lots of points (or not), but the effect on overall rank would have been pretty much non-existent.

Anyway, I was happy to be in a minority when I triple captained him. It was a good chance for a massive profitable swing, those kind of swings may earn you a very top rank (instead of just decent top 10k). I'm not expecting it to be a huge advantage anymore, but I still expect it to be a slightly profitable decision - even though I probably lose on TC points, I expect to gain them back by being able to play my other chips more effectively on the main DGWs.

[Joccki_10]

Didn't we also have Sanchez and Hazard score 25p and 26p (or 26p and 27p) in the same DGW?
Was it 15/16 or 16/17?

26 and 27 points for Agüero and Sánchez in the same DGW in 15/16, if I recall that correctly.

[Pirlo's Beard]

I pulled out

[slyger]

I was hoping for a Kane assist v Swansea. Anyone else feel the same ?

I'm wondering that myself. I didn't see the match but BBC and Sky both reported that the Alli goal was assisted by Kane

[math!]

I pulled out

[OIEIAO]

I was hoping for a Kane assist v Swansea. Anyone else feel the same ?

I'm wondering that myself. I didn't see the match but BBC and Sky both reported that the Alli goal was assisted by Kane

I've seen people raging about this on Twitter but this is correct based on the rules as I understand them.

It was Kane, to Alli, saved, Alli scored the rebound. If it had been Kane - Alli - goal, or Kane shot - saved - Alli scores rebound, he'd have got the assist. In this case Alli assisted himself by striking the shot that was saved, so there was no assist awarded.

[Highlander12]

I was hoping for a Kane assist v Swansea. Anyone else feel the same ?

I'm wondering that myself. I didn't see the match but BBC and Sky both reported that the Alli goal was assisted by Kane

I've seen people raging about this on Twitter but this correct based on the rules as I understand them.

It was Kane, to Alli, saved, Alli scored the rebound. If it had been Kane - Alli - goal, or Kane shot - saved - Alli scores rebound, he'd have got the assist. In this case Alli assisted himself by striking the shot that was saved, so there was no assist awarded.

Yep, Alli's shite finishing cost us the assist. Scores after he trips himself up to rub salt into the wound.

[Football Hero]

Have to wait and see what Kane does vs. West Ham. If he's benched again then yeah, it's a disaster. If he scores a hit trick then it'll be a big win.

Nope. 18 tripled is a par score for the TC. Anything less than 15 is a fail. 21 or better and you have done well with it.

Probably true, but as you can see the difference between fail and success is just 6 points, so it's really the least valuable chip in the game.

I would give the BB a slightly lower range. In addition, the BB requires more preparation and often has invisible hits one side or the other of playing it. The BB is the least important chip in my opinion.

Good luck trying to get that. Salah is the highest averaging regular starter with 8.0 PPG. So you need Salah to exceed his current average by 30% or better twice in a few days for you to have done well? I know Sanchez ripped out a 27 last year when everyone TCed him so expectations for it would be high once again this year, but I don't know...

You are making the wrong calculation. A par captain score is 8 points. Last season the top 12 teams averaged 8.67 doubled (and once tripled) on captaincy and the top 20k teams averaged 7.86 doubled (based on a random sample). Presumably the TC chip is to be deployed with more care than the weekly captaincy decision because you only get to play it once in 38 games. And presumably in a DGW. So 18 is a fair par score. The season before last, Aguero and Sanchez scored 25 & 26 (from memory) in GW34 and last season Kane scored 27 in GW37 (again from memory). If you prioritise the TC and play it in its optimum slot then you can reasonably hope for 21+ at least.

Finisher1 is right in the underlying analysis that you cannot prioritise all the chips equally. He and I only differ in that I consider the BB to be the weakest and most expendable of the chips and that will be the one I deploy when it is convenient, rather than the TC.

What you seem to be missing though, is that you can do all the groundwork, captain a player that you expect to get 21 points over their double, (that personally seems a bit high considering one of the fixtures may be a poor one as you don't know what the future DGW's will look like yet, but whatever). So yeah, you captain them, but they don't actually get 21 points, they score 7 points instead. Going by your logic that would be considered a 'fail', even though you did everything right.

So with Kane this week, with 5 days to get over a cold and is a player that plays virtually every game that he is fit for, with two decent fixtures, he should easily be projected to score 17 points in the DGW where he is guaranteed to start both games. Adjusting it down slightly for his potential lack of game time in the first fixture, you're still looking at 14 points in total, which is a decent return when you can't guarantee the make-up and fitness of players over future DGW's.

So the Kane TC'ers have done fairly well here imo, irrespective of what score Kane actually returns them. They haven't failed, they've used their TC chip in a decent spot, perhaps an 8/10 type spot, with no guarantee that future 9/10 or 10/10 DGW opportunities open up in the rest of the season.

[Ruth_NZ]

Going by your logic that would be considered a 'fail', even though you did everything right.

Yep. I had a 15-pointer TC last season and considered it disappointing. It's no different to captaincy, if you don't get at least 6-7 points it's a (c) fail in my book. I don't attach anything to that, it's simply a measure of the outcome.

As for future possibilities - you are right, the specifics are uncertain. But we know there will be around 20-24 team/DGWs to come, probably including all or most of the big teams having more than one. It's hard to imagine that there won't be a good opportunity amongst those.

Please don't misunderstand me; had Kane been fully fit I'd have TC'd him this week. I have no axe to grind here. I'm just offering a benchmark (the one I use) as to whether you did well or not with that chip.

[Football Hero]

I would say that a fully fit Kane, Salah, Aguero etc. with two good home games is a 10/10 spot.

A fully fit Kane with a good away game and a good home game, or a partially fit Kane with two good home games is 9/10. I would also say a fully fit Hazard, KDB etc., (players with a lower PPG than the top group), with two good home games would also be a 9/10 spot.

An 8/10 is a partially fit Kane with a good home and a good away game, or a fully fit Kane with two good away games or a fully fit Kane with a good away game and a bad home game.

An so on from there...

So to beat an 8/10 spot, it's pretty difficult, you need a lot to go your way to get a 9/10 or 10/10 situation in the future. The types of situations would be very likely to be normally distributed, with 1/10, 2/10, 9/10 and 10/10 situations being quite rare compared to many 5/10 and 6/10 situations for instance.

[germainelefoe]

HK just on SSN saying he's back to 100% and looking forward to tonight after coming on as a sub in the last game.

Pray for the ppl who didnt TC him

[yeboah]

Ideal for me tonight would be 2 point Alli and a hat-trick for Harry....

[Magic]

Pray for the ppl who didnt TC him

Prayers better saved for those who've just wasted their TC

[MPTree]

There are a plenty of Kane TC-ers round these parts and I suspect we're all feeling a bit fragile. That in mind, I would just like to pre-emptively say:

Be gentle with us.

[gallus]

That went well

[Notned]

9 point triple captain score, what a result!

[um09a2k]

Not too bothered. Everyone either captained or TC'ed Kane. In fact i'm glad I'm rid of the TC chip because it was doing my head in. FPL took a turn for the worse when they introduced these silly chips.

Yes i'm slightly bitter..

[math!]

There are a plenty of Kane TC-ers round these parts and I suspect we're all feeling a bit fragile. That in mind, I would just like to pre-emptively say:

Be gentle with us.

Those of us who didn't TC or (C) Kane will probably just waste it in a different GW IF it helps, there were some of us that captained Aguero and Man City started so well against Watford that it might have been worse.