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Defensive Gems 16/17

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Aldershot Rejects »

MoSe wrote:
Pirlo's Beard wrote:
Billy Bongo [b][color=#FF0000]QUOTING A POST FROM 3 MONTHS AGO[/color][/b] :P wrote:
DanCaek wrote:Who is this mythical Lenihan you speak of?
Hull defender likely to score less than 1 point every game
So basically the same as all other Hull defenders.
But the others cost more
the "mythical Lenihan" ( :lol: is he a Leviathan?) is one of the only three 3.9m Defenders in the market, all injured

HUL Lenihan -- Knee injury - Expected back 22 Oct
EVE Pennington -- Hamstring injury - Unknown return date
EVE Browning -- Knee injury - Unknown return date

at least he's the one with a known and close return date...
...provided it doesn't get set further back, and regardless how much game time his boss would give him even when game fit

as I think it was posted elsewhere, his only merit is making you spare that extra 0.1m if you desperately need it
And interestingly enough ownership of all 3 is growing despite their injuries. It means at the moment we are unlikely to see any 3.8m defenders because once someone drops to 3.9m other people looking to save the extra 0.1m begin to pile in.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Resonare »

Clyne looks very good from GW 11 onward.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by nufctoon »

Resonare wrote:Clyne looks very good from GW 11 onward.
What's not to like about GW9 and GW10 fixtures (WBA and cry)?

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Resonare »

nufctoon wrote:
Resonare wrote:Clyne looks very good from GW 11 onward.
What's not to like about GW9 and GW10 fixtures (WBA and cry)?
Bad record against Pulis teams, even under Klopp Liverpool have only ever managed to get scoring draws and one of them was thanks to a last minute fluky deflection by Origi.

Away to Palace is so-so, might manage a CS but wouldn't bet on it with the way Palace play with Benteke.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Mav3rick »

Baines' injury is making me look for a new defensive gem, quite like the look (and fit with my other defenders) of Leicester's fixtures.

Anyone think Leicester defenders look like good investments?

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by bspittles »

I think Leicester will improve once the CL winter break starts. They seem very distracted the game before a CL match.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by blahblah »

And as good as qualified, and shoud have top spot nailed soon?

That said Morgan is pants.....

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Aldershot Rejects »

Leicester certainly worth considering although I wouldn't play them every week at the moment.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Mav3rick »

I was looking for someone who can patch the bad fixtures in my defence, someone like Fuchs fits the bill, but as you have all said the CL hangover is a worry and then I'd not want to play him in GW10 anyway.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Mav3rick »

Although having spent the last half hour looking, I don't really see any options other than a Leicester defender anyway. I suspect that actually the best option is skipping forward a few weeks and to that aim I think I would just bring in a WBA defender as late as possible (i.e. when Baines is about to drop). I won't play him for two GWs at least, but going forward I think that's the better option.

Luckily Baines' drop looks like it will take a little while so I'll probably watch out for Brunt this week and see if he starts. If I can hold out until GW11 then that would be ideal, but I suspect I'll need to shift Baines on before the GW10 deadline.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by The Username »

Mav3rick wrote:Although having spent the last half hour looking, I don't really see any options other than a Leicester defender anyway. I suspect that actually the best option is skipping forward a few weeks and to that aim I think I would just bring in a WBA defender as late as possible (i.e. when Baines is about to drop). I won't play him for two GWs at least, but going forward I think that's the better option.

Luckily Baines' drop looks like it will take a little while so I'll probably watch out for Brunt this week and see if he starts. If I can hold out until GW11 then that would be ideal, but I suspect I'll need to shift Baines on before the GW10 deadline.
Leicester have nice fixtures stretching well into the new year mate, they also have as many clean sheets as anyone and have a lot of tough fixtures already under their belts, the only concern is when they concede they have done so epic-ally. I think their defenders are some what under the radar and think ill be sporting one in a fortnight.

I know your selling Baines, but really see value in Everton defenders, Jags and Willians at 5.1 i think are a safe pair of hands. The only other value i see with fixtures is Daniels at Bourmouth at 4.9. Though Lovren at 4.9 also has good fixtures - i never trust Liverpool at the back personally, so i always just rule them out.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Aldershot Rejects »

The Username wrote:
Mav3rick wrote:Although having spent the last half hour looking, I don't really see any options other than a Leicester defender anyway. I suspect that actually the best option is skipping forward a few weeks and to that aim I think I would just bring in a WBA defender as late as possible (i.e. when Baines is about to drop). I won't play him for two GWs at least, but going forward I think that's the better option.

Luckily Baines' drop looks like it will take a little while so I'll probably watch out for Brunt this week and see if he starts. If I can hold out until GW11 then that would be ideal, but I suspect I'll need to shift Baines on before the GW10 deadline.
Leicester have nice fixtures stretching well into the new year mate, they also have as many clean sheets as anyone and have a lot of tough fixtures already under their belts, the only concern is when they concede they have done so epic-ally. I think their defenders are some what under the radar and think ill be sporting one in a fortnight.

I know your selling Baines, but really see value in Everton defenders, Jags and Willians at 5.1 i think are a safe pair of hands. The only other value i see with fixtures is Daniels at Bourmouth at 4.9. Though Lovren at 4.9 also has good fixtures - i never trust Liverpool at the back personally, so i always just rule them out.
I'm looking at Fuchs from GW11. They look very strong defensively against all but the top half dozen in the league but because they have conceded 3 or 4 in some of the tough games I think people are ignoring them. Looking at their fixtures apart from tot (GW10) and MCI (GW15) they have a really nice run coming up.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by The Username »

Aldershot Rejects wrote:
The Username wrote:
Mav3rick wrote:Although having spent the last half hour looking, I don't really see any options other than a Leicester defender anyway. I suspect that actually the best option is skipping forward a few weeks and to that aim I think I would just bring in a WBA defender as late as possible (i.e. when Baines is about to drop). I won't play him for two GWs at least, but going forward I think that's the better option.

Luckily Baines' drop looks like it will take a little while so I'll probably watch out for Brunt this week and see if he starts. If I can hold out until GW11 then that would be ideal, but I suspect I'll need to shift Baines on before the GW10 deadline.
Leicester have nice fixtures stretching well into the new year mate, they also have as many clean sheets as anyone and have a lot of tough fixtures already under their belts, the only concern is when they concede they have done so epic-ally. I think their defenders are some what under the radar and think ill be sporting one in a fortnight.

I know your selling Baines, but really see value in Everton defenders, Jags and Willians at 5.1 i think are a safe pair of hands. The only other value i see with fixtures is Daniels at Bourmouth at 4.9. Though Lovren at 4.9 also has good fixtures - i never trust Liverpool at the back personally, so i always just rule them out.
I'm looking at Fuchs from GW11. They look very strong defensively against all but the top half dozen in the league but because they have conceded 3 or 4 in some of the tough games I think people are ignoring them. Looking at their fixtures apart from tot (GW10) and MCI (GW15) they have a really nice run coming up.
Only Spurs have kept more clean sheets then Leicester, Here is the breakdown

Spurs = 4
Leicester= 3
Arsenal=3
Chelsea =3
Southampton = 3

You could argue that Leicester have had the toughest start as well, they could be great value.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by DonTanTilla »

Im looking at Leicester, im looking at Bournemouth. Im looking at Liverpool. As good value as some of these guys are, when i look at clean sheet odds from the bookies I just struggle to overlook Stones again at 5.0, but i dont wanna put him in for some reason!

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by scarletjim »

I see Holebas is still rising heavily - is this mainly because he scored last week (i.e. chasing points), or is there actually good reason to believe he'll continue to score well? I notice that he has had far more shots than most defenders - does anyone watch Watford often? Does he really get forward that much? Is that primarily through set pieces, or from open play?

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Weisenwolf »

He's
scarletjim wrote:I see Holebas is still rising heavily - is this mainly because he scored last week (i.e. chasing points), or is there actually good reason to believe he'll continue to score well? I notice that he has had far more shots than most defenders - does anyone watch Watford often? Does he really get forward that much? Is that primarily through set pieces, or from open play?
There are always people chasing last weeks points but there is an argument for bringing him in:

Watford's first five games were pretty tough; he still managed a goal v West Ham but little else. He got nothing week 6 v Burnley either but week 7 v Bournemouth he got an assist and 2 BP's (A pretty decent side IMHO; look what they did to Hull the week after!)and he got a goal, CS and 3 BP's last weekend at Boro.

He's playing in an advance position most of the time, he looks pretty good and many are guessing he is about to hit form with Swansea Away and Hull at home next up. Fixture wise Watford have a mixed bag and don't really have a horror show run until the end of April which at least follows a good run immediately before it.

Despite the very tough start he's the 10th highest points scoring defender, he's cheap, all of those above him cost more (You have to go down to Gibson in 19th for a similarly price player). He's also 3rd in the form table behind Bellerin & Kos which indicates nicely his points are recent and therefore more relevant going forward.

So the speculation is that it's likely he will keep picking up points with the prospect of further price rises too and a profit if/when he needs to make way (He's only got 3.7% ownership so the possibility of a a few rises if he does kick on is certainly there)

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Mav3rick »

Those are all excellent reasons to own him WW, however I think 95%+ of transfers in (on any big mover) are driven purely by last weeks points :D

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by scarletjim »

Weisenwolf wrote:He's
scarletjim wrote:I see Holebas is still rising heavily - is this mainly because he scored last week (i.e. chasing points), or is there actually good reason to believe he'll continue to score well? I notice that he has had far more shots than most defenders - does anyone watch Watford often? Does he really get forward that much? Is that primarily through set pieces, or from open play?
There are always people chasing last weeks points but there is an argument for bringing him in:

Watford's first five games were pretty tough; he still managed a goal v West Ham but little else. He got nothing week 6 v Burnley either but week 7 v Bournemouth he got an assist and 2 BP's (A pretty decent side IMHO; look what they did to Hull the week after!)and he got a goal, CS and 3 BP's last weekend at Boro.

He's playing in an advance position most of the time, he looks pretty good and many are guessing he is about to hit form with Swansea Away and Hull at home next up. Fixture wise Watford have a mixed bag and don't really have a horror show run until the end of April which at least follows a good run immediately before it.

Despite the very tough start he's the 10th highest points scoring defender, he's cheap, all of those above him cost more (You have to go down to Gibson in 19th for a similarly price player). He's also 3rd in the form table behind Bellerin & Kos which indicates nicely his points are recent and therefore more relevant going forward.

So the speculation is that it's likely he will keep picking up points with the prospect of further price rises too and a profit if/when he needs to make way (He's only got 3.7% ownership so the possibility of a a few rises if he does kick on is certainly there)
Very interesting, thanks. When you say 'he's playing in an advance position most of the time', what do you mean exactly? Surely if he's part of the defence then he holds a similar line to his colleagues? Or does he move well into midfield the way that (for example) Stones does sometimes? How on earth does he get into positions enabling him to have so many shots without leaving big holes at the back? Or does he leave such big holes?

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Notned »

scarletjim wrote:
Weisenwolf wrote:He's
scarletjim wrote:I see Holebas is still rising heavily - is this mainly because he scored last week (i.e. chasing points), or is there actually good reason to believe he'll continue to score well? I notice that he has had far more shots than most defenders - does anyone watch Watford often? Does he really get forward that much? Is that primarily through set pieces, or from open play?
There are always people chasing last weeks points but there is an argument for bringing him in:

Watford's first five games were pretty tough; he still managed a goal v West Ham but little else. He got nothing week 6 v Burnley either but week 7 v Bournemouth he got an assist and 2 BP's (A pretty decent side IMHO; look what they did to Hull the week after!)and he got a goal, CS and 3 BP's last weekend at Boro.

He's playing in an advance position most of the time, he looks pretty good and many are guessing he is about to hit form with Swansea Away and Hull at home next up. Fixture wise Watford have a mixed bag and don't really have a horror show run until the end of April which at least follows a good run immediately before it.

Despite the very tough start he's the 10th highest points scoring defender, he's cheap, all of those above him cost more (You have to go down to Gibson in 19th for a similarly price player). He's also 3rd in the form table behind Bellerin & Kos which indicates nicely his points are recent and therefore more relevant going forward.

So the speculation is that it's likely he will keep picking up points with the prospect of further price rises too and a profit if/when he needs to make way (He's only got 3.7% ownership so the possibility of a a few rises if he does kick on is certainly there)
Very interesting, thanks. When you say 'he's playing in an advance position most of the time', what do you mean exactly? Surely if he's part of the defence then he holds a similar line to his colleagues? Or does he move well into midfield the way that (for example) Stones does sometimes? How on earth does he get into positions enabling him to have so many shots without leaving big holes at the back? Or does he leave such big holes?

Plays virtually as a winger when they are on the attack, likes a shot, takes corners, and has the lions' share of direct free kicks...

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by TheoRiginal »

Also, I think he is on four yellows, and apparently without a get out clause like Costs....

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by BobMem »

4 yellows nowhere near as important for a defender as an attacker IMO.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by scarletjim »

Notned wrote: Plays virtually as a winger when they are on the attack, likes a shot, takes corners, and has the lions' share of direct free kicks...
Hmm, the more I hear the more I want him. Got another 12 hours or so to decide between him and Lovren I guess...

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Resonare »

DonTanTilla wrote:Im looking at Leicester, im looking at Bournemouth. Im looking at Liverpool. As good value as some of these guys are, when i look at clean sheet odds from the bookies I just struggle to overlook Stones again at 5.0, but i dont wanna put him in for some reason!
City couldn't keep a CS during their winning streak, what makes you think they'll manage one now :?

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by scarletjim »

When you guys pick defenders, do you normally expect the 'best' or most expensive 2 to start all games (with either the 3rd playing all games too, or the 3rd and 4th rotating)?

I've just looked at my WC team for the next 8 gameweeks (I know things change, but I'm just looking for an indication). I'd pick my most expensive defender 5 or 6 times, my 2nd all 8 times, my 3rd 5 or 6 times, my 4th 3 or 4 times, and my 5th not at all - is that normal? Does everyone pick their team depending on games, or do you all just say that your premium defenders should play every game, even away at a top 6 side?

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Aldershot Rejects »

scarletjim wrote:When you guys pick defenders, do you normally expect the 'best' or most expensive 2 to start all games (with either the 3rd playing all games too, or the 3rd and 4th rotating)?

I've just looked at my WC team for the next 8 gameweeks (I know things change, but I'm just looking for an indication). I'd pick my most expensive defender 5 or 6 times, my 2nd all 8 times, my 3rd 5 or 6 times, my 4th 3 or 4 times, and my 5th not at all - is that normal? Does everyone pick their team depending on games, or do you all just say that your premium defenders should play every game, even away at a top 6 side?
I try and be flexible. In the next 8 games, I suspect I'll leave my most expensive defender on the bench once. My second most expensive will probably play every game bar one but only because I am planning a transfer in that position. 3rd and 4th will rotate and on a couple of occasions both will play. Probably won't play my 5th defender at all.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Striker »

scarletjim wrote:When you say 'he's playing in an advance position most of the time', what do you mean exactly? Surely if he's part of the defence then he holds a similar line to his colleagues? Or does he move well into midfield the way that (for example) Stones does sometimes? How on earth does he get into positions enabling him to have so many shots without leaving big holes at the back? Or does he leave such big holes?
Not at all like Stones. Remember that Watford are often playing 3-5-2, so although the comparisons aren't valid in some ways, think more Antonio (as a wing back) or Alonso. However Holebas isn't as attractive now as he was a couple of weeks ago but still a strong "hold" at least until after the Hull game. He is miles away from being in line with the back three when Watford have the ball.
Last edited by Striker on 22 Oct 2016, 00:39, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by Resonare »

scarletjim wrote:When you guys pick defenders, do you normally expect the 'best' or most expensive 2 to start all games (with either the 3rd playing all games too, or the 3rd and 4th rotating)?

I've just looked at my WC team for the next 8 gameweeks (I know things change, but I'm just looking for an indication). I'd pick my most expensive defender 5 or 6 times, my 2nd all 8 times, my 3rd 5 or 6 times, my 4th 3 or 4 times, and my 5th not at all - is that normal? Does everyone pick their team depending on games, or do you all just say that your premium defenders should play every game, even away at a top 6 side?
Depends how premium those premium players are. Players like Bellerin would be nailed onto my XI for sure. I can't see myself benching defenders like him even against City away unless 3 of my other defenders have amazing fixtures, and even then it would be quite painful.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by scarletjim »

Aldershot Rejects wrote:
scarletjim wrote:When you guys pick defenders, do you normally expect the 'best' or most expensive 2 to start all games (with either the 3rd playing all games too, or the 3rd and 4th rotating)?

I've just looked at my WC team for the next 8 gameweeks (I know things change, but I'm just looking for an indication). I'd pick my most expensive defender 5 or 6 times, my 2nd all 8 times, my 3rd 5 or 6 times, my 4th 3 or 4 times, and my 5th not at all - is that normal? Does everyone pick their team depending on games, or do you all just say that your premium defenders should play every game, even away at a top 6 side?
I try and be flexible. In the next 8 games, I suspect I'll leave my most expensive defender on the bench once. My second most expensive will probably play every game bar one but only because I am planning a transfer in that position. 3rd and 4th will rotate and on a couple of occasions both will play. Probably won't play my 5th defender at all.
Resonare wrote:Depends how premium those premium players are. Players like Bellerin would be nailed onto my XI for sure. I can't see myself benching defenders like him even against City away unless 3 of my other defenders have amazing fixtures, and even then it would be quite painful.
Ok that's reassuring - I've not got a 'full premium' defender, so it seems I'm not out of kilter with what other 'proper' players are doing.

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by scarletjim »

Striker wrote:
scarletjim wrote:When you say 'he's playing in an advance position most of the time', what do you mean exactly? Surely if he's part of the defence then he holds a similar line to his colleagues? Or does he move well into midfield the way that (for example) Stones does sometimes? How on earth does he get into positions enabling him to have so many shots without leaving big holes at the back? Or does he leave such big holes?
Not at all like Stones. Remember that Watford are often playing 3-5-2, so although the comparisons aren't valid in some ways, think more Antonio (as a wing back) or Alonso. However Holebas isn't as attractive now as he was a couple of weeks ago but still a strong "hold" at least until after the Hull game. He is miles away from being in line with the back three when Watford have the ball.
Aha I see, so he's not just stepping out from the back to distribute the ball, he is genuinely getting forward and getting involved in attacks. Interesting. I can't quite squeeze him in at the moment, but will be keeping an eye on him over the next few weeks (and obviously will kick myself if he scores well again in that time).

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Re: Defensive Gems 16/17

Post by DonTanTilla »

Resonare wrote: City couldn't keep a CS during their winning streak, what makes you think they'll manage one now :?
It's not really my opinion. They are 4th favourite for a cleanie this week according to the bookies and will be up there or there about's most weeks.

If you think that sort of information is rubbish you could just lump £1000 against a city clean sheet each week and watch the money roll in over the remainder of the season.

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